Talk:Ostrobothnia (historical province)

Österbotten's right name is Ostrobothnia in English. You can check it with Google if you don't believe.

Map

The map is total bollocks. -- J-V Heiskanen 15:48, 11 Mar 2004 (UTC)

The map shows some Finnish pre-war borders. Its is outdated.

The article is about the historical province. --Thorri 18:34, 22 Aug 2005 (UTC)

The map is slightly confusing, because the Karelian and Ostrobothnian border eastward are at pre-war sites, but not Lapland. (Petsamo missing). If anyone has a better map, please cange. -Islander(Scandinavia) 18:13, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

I believe that the original idea of the writer of articles Ostrobothnia, Nylandia, Savonia, Tavastia and Finland Proper was to make them part of Swedish historical provinces series. The map used is supposed to denote the borders of the Sweden Proper in the late17th century. At that time, Sweden was considered to consist of Götaland, Svealand and Finland. Ingermanland, Baltic provinces, German holdings, and, to lesser extent, Scania were but conquered provinces. The map in question tries to depict the borders of thus defined poper Sweden. The borders in Lapland are, of course, hypothetical as no clear borders between Norway, Russia, and Sweden existed there. Such borders were marked only in the early 19th century in a series of treaties and agreements between Swedish-Norwegian and Russian authorities. (At the same time, Russian and Finnish officials draw the border between the Grand Duchy and Russia, based mainly on the religion of the inhabitants and geographic features.) Petsamo region was not part of Finland before 1920's.

In my opinion, the map should be edited to mark the fluidity of the borders in the north, for example by removing the borderline and leaving only the coloured bottom. --MPorciusCato 07:24, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

I see what you mean. Sounds like a good idea. However, at the moment I have no references to check from, but I have a feeling that the extent of Karelia in this map is not as it was in the late 16-hundreds, but anybody who has their maps in order can comment. -Islander(Scandinavia) 20:20, 8 June 2006 (UTC)

The extent of Karelia in the map correponds to the peace treaty of Treaty of Tyavzino between Sweden and Russia in 1595 for the southern part and the Treaty of Stolbovo for the northern part (Province of Käkisalmi (sv. Kexholm, ru. Priozersk) . This border later formed the internal border between Finland and Ingermanland in the 17th century and, after the return of so called "Old Finland" to the Grand Duchy, the border between Russia and Grand Duchy of Finland. Between 1917-1940 it formed the border between Russia and Finland. The fluidity of the border starts only north of Oulu.--MPorciusCato 05:39, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Wow! You really know your history! I humbly confess your superior knowledge. -Islander(Scandinavia) 20:10, 9 June 2006 (UTC)

Borders

Related to the map discussion above, the notion that Ostrobothnia has land borders with Sweden is nonsense. The comment that it has a border with Vasterbotten presumably relates to period when the whole of this area was under Swedish control, and indeed Vasterbotten would be to the west, but with a significant stretch of water between the regions. David Martland (talk) 07:15, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

Yes, it's a strange statement since both provinces were in Sweden. The map is also wrong since it doesn't show the historical province which also included parts of the present Swedish province Norrbotten. See for example this map[1] Närking (talk) 08:03, 30 May 2009 (UTC)

Useless

Why do we have links for "culture in Ostrobothina" and "heraldry in Ostrobothnia" when we don't have any articles for them?! They're useless! I'm going to delete them if anyone doesn't have any objections to that. --Thorri 18:33, 22 Aug 2005 (UTC)

Earliest Human?=

The tools found at the 'wolf cave' site (dead link at bottom of article page) in Lappfjärd appear to have been made by neanderthals, not humans, according to this cached website: http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:Gb0ieyVb5I4J:sydaby.eget.net/eng/wolf/wolf_ralf.htm+varggrottan&hl=en&client=firefox-a (the original appears to not be posted anymore, if you are interested in this topic it looks like there is a Swedish book available: ISSN 0782-3649)

The Neanderthals are human too! though "early humans", not modern. (All species with "Homo" in scientific name are regarded as humans, as for instance Homo Neanderthaliensis) I added a note about this. -Islander(Scandinavia) 18:13, 7 June 2006 (UTC)

A little nitpicky I guess, but I just noticed it while reading the cached website. Hello Ostrobothnians! AMB 04:12, 20 September 2005 (UTC)

Name

This is what Encyclopaedia Britannica says: Pohjanmaa, also called Ostrobothnia, or Ostrobothnian Plain, Swedish Österbotten, lowland plain in Vaasa and Oulu läänit (provinces), western Finland. http://www.britannica.com/eb/article-9060530

Fred-Chess 21:34, 27 September 2005 (UTC)

Explanation of the name

-"The word pohja means either "north" or "bottom", and maa is "land". In ancient Scandinavian understanding, the north was the bottom of the world, where the Sun disappeared each night. The word was associated with the cardinal direction because the houses were constructed such that the back of the house faced north, the coldest direction." Finland isn't part of Scandinavia and the meaning of the Swedish name (which differ from the Finnish) of the province isn't explained at all. This should be explained better so that it doesn't lead to misunderstandings. --80.244.79.111 (talk) 17:45, 3 November 2014 (UTC)

File:Historical province of Ostrobothnia in Finland.png Nominated for speedy Deletion

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The Cudgel War

The article mentions that the Ostrobothnians revolted against the stationing of regular soldiers in their area. This is not quite the whole picture; what they were revolting against was having to house and feed the soldiers without reimbursement. Also, the Cudgel War was not solely a local uprising. It was partly fomented by agents of Duke Charles, the Protestant uncle of the Catholic King Sigismund, the concurrent ruler of Sweden and Poland. Charles had already wrested control of Sweden from his nephew and was seeking to add Finland to his territory. In this he eventually succeeded and was duly crowned King Charles IX of Sweden while Sigismund retained Poland. The Finnish nobility, who had sided with Sigismund, suffered for their choice.--Death Bredon (talk) 20:40, 15 May 2017 (UTC)