Talk:Classlessness

NPOV tag

Classlessness might, as a recent contributor contends, refer to types of society (not cited) where class does not exist. A bigger question, however, is whether class exists at all, particularly since there is no consensus measure of class. The POV implied by recent edits, that have effectively disembodied this article from what is was in early 2004 see [1], is that of an a priori assumption that class necessarily must exist and that it is taboo to suggest otherwise. There are those who have been brought up to believe or who have in any event reached the conclusion that class is a flawed and itself divisive concept. There have been many theorists who question the model promulgated by Marx/Engels. The embourgeoisement thesis of the 1950s in the US and Europe was a major initiative in bringing about classlessness as it is perceived and thereby to liberate people from self-limiting self-perceptions. If the contributors here cannot be objective on their own pronouncements on this issue then I fear this article will remain biased in the way that it currently is. Matt Stan 10:32, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)

First of all, the article that was here in early 2004 was horribly biased - so much so that I cannot imagine how you can defend it with a straight face. Not only did it present a single point of view (the one held by those who believe classes do not exist), but it also showed an utter lack of understanding of the arguments put forward by those who believe social classes do exist. The article defined "social class" as a state of mind rather than an economic position. Therefore, its content is better suited for articles that discuss class consciousness, class identity and other things related to the state of mind of people within a certain social class. It is not suited for an article on classlessness.

Also, a consensus measure of class is not necessary in order for classlessness to exist. We can talk about the different views on classlessness held by different groups that oppose each other's views. But in order for the notion of "classlessness" to make sense, you must first accept that some sort of classes do exist. -- Mihnea Tudoreanu 01:41, 13 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I've put a link in the article to class consciousness. Some of the eariler content of the classlessness article had been moved to class consciousness, but whoever moved it didn't consider it worthwhile to put in a link - more evidence, I contend of the POV that some are using this article for. Matt Stan 10:32, 3 Jan 2005 (UTC)