Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Psychoanalytical feminism
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This page is an archive of the discussion about the proposed deletion of the article below. This page is no longer live. Further comments should be made on the article's talk page rather than here so that this page is preserved as an historic record.
The result of the debate was Move to Psychoanalytic feminism. Deathphoenix 17:52, 27 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
I don't believe there is any such thing. What this page says defines a number of different kinds of feminism, and is not distinctly psychoanalytical. This Googles 215, but these are predominantly either Wikipedia-related or references to psychoanalytical feminism in academic context which don't identify it as a distinct perspective i.e. they just identify academic speech which is both psychoanalytical and feminist.XmarkX 17:30, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- The article that was proposed for deletion by Mgekelly was a substub - I have just expanded it a little so we know what we are talking about. Psychoanalytical feminism is one of the main ideas in feminism, it is often quoted next to marxist feminism, radical feminism, liberal feminism etc., so abolutely keep. --Fenice 18:23, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep: I didn't check history, and the original nomination might have been fine, but there certainly is Feminism based on Psychoanalysis (although, frankly, Lacan is a much more common source than Freud), as the entire ecrit feminine thing was based on psychoanalysis, and that has been (gulp) influential (despite my railing at it). However, it is very, very easy to go very, very wrong in an article like this. NPOV and comprehensiveness are vital. Any stub will be a misrepresentation. Geogre 19:02, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Good points George - I was reading it as 'Freudian feminism' which seemed a bit weird, but your mention of Lacan makes me think of Kristeva and Irigaray. Still, I don't think that there's a specific form of feminism they represent - move to Psychoanalysis and Feminism perhaps?XmarkX 19:08, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Could also be a rather large section in Feminism and Feminist theory and Feminist criticism, with this lemma becoming a redirect. I think the psychoanalytically-derived stuff is fading from the spotlight these days, with more Marxist inspired criticisms ascendant (I hope so, anyway, as I was so sick of the transhistorical subject posited by psycho crit), but a lot of the "body" criticism is, at root, psychoanalytic in inspiration. May change my vote, esp. if there are sections already present in Feminism that cover the discussion. Geogre 01:44, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Good points George - I was reading it as 'Freudian feminism' which seemed a bit weird, but your mention of Lacan makes me think of Kristeva and Irigaray. Still, I don't think that there's a specific form of feminism they represent - move to Psychoanalysis and Feminism perhaps?XmarkX 19:08, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep - this smells too much of "I've never heard of it, let's delete it!" -- AlexR 20:20, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Well, Google only gets eight hits for the term, so there are lots of people in the world who never heard of the term, either. Don't attack nominations, deal with them with wikiquette. Delete. RickK 21:52, May 19, 2005 (UTC)
- Rick, there are many more than eight hits (see here). Why did you link to the fifth page of results, and not the first? --bainer 01:23, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Interesting. When I linked to that, there were only 8 hits, now there are 50. I linked to the last page in order to show the correct count of unique hits. People are always trying to give us a count of Google hits which includes the counts for every occurrence of the term in every page, the unique count shows us the number of pages which include the term. RickK 20:41, May 20, 2005 (UTC)
- Do you have a source for this assertion? Kappa 22:16, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Uh, all you have to do is count the pages. When you look at the link I included above, it currently says 229 hits, but when you go to the last page, it says, "51 - 53 of about 227". This means 53 pages are shown, all of the other hits are multiple hits on the same page. RickK 21:28, May 21, 2005 (UTC)
- OK, I can't find anything specific on any of the Google help pages which addresses this, so I've placed the question on news:google.public.support.general. I'll report on the response. RickK 21:36, May 21, 2005 (UTC)
- Still waiting for a response. RickK 23:06, May 22, 2005 (UTC)
- That still doesn't address the fact that there are yet more hits under "psychoanalytic feminism" and probably still more for feminism lacan and feminism freud. -Seth Mahoney 00:12, May 23, 2005 (UTC)
- Still waiting for a response. RickK 23:06, May 22, 2005 (UTC)
- OK, I can't find anything specific on any of the Google help pages which addresses this, so I've placed the question on news:google.public.support.general. I'll report on the response. RickK 21:36, May 21, 2005 (UTC)
- Uh, all you have to do is count the pages. When you look at the link I included above, it currently says 229 hits, but when you go to the last page, it says, "51 - 53 of about 227". This means 53 pages are shown, all of the other hits are multiple hits on the same page. RickK 21:28, May 21, 2005 (UTC)
- Do you have a source for this assertion? Kappa 22:16, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Interesting. When I linked to that, there were only 8 hits, now there are 50. I linked to the last page in order to show the correct count of unique hits. People are always trying to give us a count of Google hits which includes the counts for every occurrence of the term in every page, the unique count shows us the number of pages which include the term. RickK 20:41, May 20, 2005 (UTC)
- Rick, there are many more than eight hits (see here). Why did you link to the fifth page of results, and not the first? --bainer 01:23, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Well, Google only gets eight hits for the term, so there are lots of people in the world who never heard of the term, either. Don't attack nominations, deal with them with wikiquette. Delete. RickK 21:52, May 19, 2005 (UTC)
- Strong keep and move to "psychoanalytic feminism" (more common term). It is definitely a distinct perspective on feminism. Key American contributors include Nancy Chodorow, Dorothy Dinnerstein and Teresa Brennan. Keep keep keep. FreplySpang (talk) 20:29, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep expand and move as suggested by Freply Spang. Topic with definite potential for encyclopedic article. Capitalistroadster 21:18, 19 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Keep and rename as per FreplySpang. Google gets about 215 hits for this term, and about 730 for "psychoanalytic feminism." --bainer 01:23, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- OMG keep! Well, actually, redirect to Psychoanalytic feminism. Feminism rooted in psychoanalysis has been pretty big for something like thirty years now. And as far as hits go, yeah, there are 215 (some of them Wikipedia and Wikipedia mirrors) for "Psychananalytical feminism" and another 734 for "Psychanalytic feminism". -Seth Mahoney 03:06, May 20, 2005 (UTC)
- Move to Psychoanalytic feminism, and expand. Valid encyclopaedia topic. Megan1967 07:10, 20 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- Seth is correct. This should be moved to Psychoanalytic feminism and kept. Leanne 11:25, 24 May 2005 (UTC)[reply]
- This page is now preserved as an archive of the debate and, like some other VfD subpages, is no longer 'live'. Subsequent comments on the issue, the deletion, or the decision-making process should be placed on the relevant 'live' pages. Please do not edit this page.